{"id":320,"date":"2025-03-05T20:42:23","date_gmt":"2025-03-05T20:42:23","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/bim4housing.com\/operations\/?page_id=320"},"modified":"2025-03-09T12:57:02","modified_gmt":"2025-03-09T12:57:02","slug":"bim4housing-operations-working-group-meeting-05-03-2025","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/bim4housing.com\/operations\/bim4housing-operations-working-group-meeting-05-03-2025\/","title":{"rendered":"BIM4Housing: Operations Working Group Meeting 05-03-2025"},"content":{"rendered":"
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BIM4HOUSING: OPERATIONS WORKING GROUP MEETING 05-03-2025<\/strong><\/h2>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON I had a meeting with the HSE on Monday with the people that we\u2019ve been dealing with on the standardised health & safety file. One of the challenges that I think everybody struggles with is that all of the handover information that\u2019s coming through is unique. So, depending on which contractor has actually done the work and which O&M complier has been commissioned to do the work you end up with a very different set of information. And the difficulty is, as any landlord how do you check to see if you\u2019ve got all of the information that you required? And one of the biggest challenges for the FMs is that the information is typically compiled by work package, because that\u2019s the easiest way for the construction firms to actually procure the information.<\/p>\n

Whereas people that are actually running the buildings are typically working by system. Or they\u2019re working by groups of assets that need to be performed in a certain way. So, one of the things that we\u2019ve been doing for over a year now is trying to come up with a more standardised way of managing this information. You might call it a folder structure, but actually it\u2019s more a table of contents, so that if people are collecting information in, for example, SharePoint, and then they want to transfer it into something that\u2019s a bit more permanent, the folder structure doesn\u2019t become the critical thing. The folder structure is perhaps how you\u2019ve collected the information, rather than how you want to view it.<\/p>\n

So, that\u2019s where we\u2019ve been doing quite a lot of work, which I can illustrate to you. Within BIM In Asset Management as well we\u2019ve now found that several of the contractors are keen on this because they\u2019re finding. The way they normally do it is they outsource it to a third party who spends their time phoning up supply chain members to chase them for documents. They can\u2019t get them because it\u2019s not always easy to get those documents, so they then report in back to somebody like Waites and Waites have either got to decide whether it\u2019s worth pursuing the subcontractor, or not. And I think that they recognise now that it\u2019s a lot better if they do the collection of the information and oversee it because they\u2019ve got more authority. But, I think we\u2019re going through an evolution there.<\/p>\n

The other aspect is looking at things from a point of view of what\u2019s critical because there\u2019s an overwhelming amount of information, and it\u2019s a matter of identifying what is likely to catch you out. And one of the shorthands that we\u2019ve done to do that is looking at the fire safety information and in particular Regulation 38. To look at that from a point of view of what should be provided at handover and then using that as a basis to say that\u2019s what should be maintained going forward. Certainly Bex and Dave, you\u2019ve been on that journey with us. Bex, do you have any comment or contribution to what I\u2019ve just said?<\/p>\n

BEX GIBSON It\u2019s been a bit of a journey and I\u2019ve actually changed roles in this journey of from the client to a consultant. And I\u2019ve been dealing with recently Reg 38 files and trying to get the information from those into a building safety case report and such like. And I think there is disparity in content, from obviously different contractors and clients. And generally though, the content is there if you look for it, but I think it would be good to have a standardised way of receiving it, jut to make that a little bit more easy and fluid going to operations as well. So, at the moment, as far as I\u2019m aware, most people just accept a Reg 38 file and then pass it on. And people just go off and do what they want to do, it doesn\u2019t feel like there\u2019s a proper process in place.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Dave, anything from you?<\/p>\n

DAVE WILLIAMS Echoing what you said, basically extracting the relevant data from the documentation is the biggest manual overhead of the handover process. Because not just for Reg 38, but for virtually every component, be it kitchens, bathrooms etc., that because of the format of the information when it comes across there\u2019s definitely a sort of manual search of documentation in order to find the relevant data and stick that into something else. In order for that to then populate whatever backend asset management system that you\u2019ve got because, at the end of the day, that when it comes to particularly the golden thread, it is your asset management system that\u2019s managing servicing and maintenance. And that is a crucial component of proving that you\u2019re keeping that building safe.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Yeah, what was interesting about that, i was having a meeting last week with Chris Bicknell, he\u2019s a real expert in strategic asset management, he used to work at AECOM. And he was telling me something that I\u2019d not actually realised and that is\u00a0 one of the big challenges is that there\u2019s a lot of things that get installed in buildings that have got warranties. But the information about what those warranties are is often not collected. And it\u2019s also not transferred, often, from the contractor, so the warranty is generally with the organisation that bought the product, rather than the people who are actually going to run it. Which is obviously madness, that\u2019s not what\u2019s supposed to be done. But, you\u2019ll find that the handover between those two things is contractually very seldom done properly.<\/p>\n

Now, I\u2019ve know that for a long time and it\u2019s something that we are trying to encourage, but one of the things that I wasn\u2019t aware of is that there\u2019s a lot of products where the manufacturer requires a certain inspection of that product once it\u2019s been installed, after 3 months. And if you don\u2019t that warranty, even if it\u2019s a 5 or 10 year warranty, is void. I don\u2019t know how many people know that. Is that geared into whatever the handover process is? Is that built into something that should be checked? Were you aware of that?<\/p>\n

BEX GIBSON That\u2019s really interesting, though, as well because I\u2019ve got a question off of the back of that. What if it was installed 3 months before handover? And that\u2019s one of the things as well, is that even a suitable way of operating a warranty?<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON I entirely agree and in fact actually there\u2019s lots of examples where, for example, lighting is put in a year or 2 years before the building is finished. And it\u2019s actually used for that period as well. So therefore, the warranty for that product, the life of that product, should start from when it starts being used. And I\u2019ve heard the term beneficial use, so it\u2019s at that point that things start to kick in. So, I guess what I\u2019m saying is we can\u2019t answer those questions, but I think they\u2019re questions that the operations group should be able to ask. What do you think on that, Sen?<\/p>\n

SOUMAN SEN I do see it more from an operational element and that\u2019s a common occurrence, we have a servicing and maintenance schedule to give you an idea of a quarterly something should be maintained. We\u2019ll raise the questions about when was it installed and if something has been installed 9 months before practical completion and handover, so there\u2019s only 3 months left. Now there\u2019s a question of the developer, we ask those guys and whether you extend the warranty, their usual comeback is this is not in the EIRs, it wasn\u2019t a requirement off of the bat so we\u2019re not going to do it. But then there\u2019s an element of when we\u2019re handing over to our repairs contractors.<\/p>\n

I work for a local authority, they\u2019re very reactionary to issues, so when they\u2019re taking on newer stock, honestly they\u2019re not geared towards thinking like that. They don\u2019t think about maintaining the asset from an earlier stage, bringing onboard guarantees, working with external partners, they work with their internal contractors. And I\u2019ve seen, unfortunately, within a year, within the defects period if something hasn\u2019t been maintained the developer will say that it\u2019s not been serviced, so we\u2019re not going to touch it. Elements have been ripped out and replaced, and it\u2019s just poor management, poor management. And it\u2019s not a one off, I\u2019ve seen that often.<\/p>\n

DAVE WILLIAMS I don\u2019t know whether it\u2019s worth me sharing this, just to give you an idea of some of the stuff that we have to go through. (shares screen<\/em>). This is one of our recent developments and obviously we mention around Regulation 38. But you can see that we list the manufacturer, the warranty details if there are any, any information about servicing packages, whether we\u2019ve got the certificates, the service contracts expiry dates etc. And this is just one of the spreadsheets that we have to complete, just on any of the components. And there is yet another spreadsheet which covers off things like the actual make and model of any installed equipment. So, you can see we\u2019ve got quite a lot of information on this particular sheet, but once again, this is only part of the information that we actually have.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Could you go to the top of that\u2026that\u2019s obviously quite similar to the work that we\u2019ve been doing on Medeas House, so that\u2019s good. If we just look here at the different asset types, from what I\u2019m seeing there a lot of that information could be delivered as part of the COBie.<\/p>\n

DAVE WILLIAMS Yeah, the difficulty we found is trying to get any of the principal contractors and designers to provide us with a fully loaded COBie spreadsheet. But I thought I\u2019d share that, just to show you one example of one of the many files that we deal with when it comes to a new development coming across.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Is that part of what you\u2019 re doing, Bex, within RLB? Auditing handover information?<\/p>\n

BEX GIBSON No, I\u2019m more post-occupancy, the building safety case reporting, that side of things.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON And does anybody do that within RWBD now?<\/p>\n

BEX GIBSON We do loads of multidisciplinary things, I\u2019m sure that there are departments.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON What do you do, Connor?<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON I\u2019m currently a building surveyor or stock condition surveyor with Wheatley? Homes in Scotland. Previously, and hopefully in the future, I was a BIM manager for a part of the Sure Serve Group, but that got shut down and when I moved to Wheatley they said they wanted to adopt BIM stuff and it\u2019s 7 months down the line and I\u2019m still waiting. I don\u2019t know if I\u2019m in the right meeting.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON We have a number of different working groups and we can certainly point you at the right ones for what you\u2019re doing. This actually is the operations group, so the principle of this group is to look at receiving BIM information and doing something with it.<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON I was out surveying or doing what they call an SBA, so I was out surveying properties, blocks of flats today to see what level, if any, of the DWS forms would be required. And what we might need to do in terms of getting information and nobody on the site even know what BIM was. I was listening to someone<\/em> talk about information, does anybody adopt digital twin? Because Autodesk have a good platform called Tandem. And instead of going through a SharePoint, which is the bane of any site-based professional, because it\u2019s a nightmare to work on tablet and mobile. Is having someday one of the task teams that access the data or information media.<\/p>\n

And they get a login for Autodesk\u2019s Tandem platform and then they can just put it straight on to the object, if they have any information in any format. Whether it be a PDF, a JPEG, a link that I scan. And then instead of having a folder format you have this 3D model digital twin being built at the same time. So, that\u2019s just something I thought I\u2019d put out there as an alternative. It\u2019s quite good as well because if you\u2019ve got the warranties and stuff coming in and the warranties are actually attached to the object. And everybody knows what\u00a0 a house looks like, or\u00a0 a block of flats or any kind of building, so they can navigate through the model and you can filter down to that and it pops up before your warranties and stuff.<\/p>\n

If you don\u2019t start your warranty within 3 months of it being installed, I\u2019m not sure how the manufacturer of the product is going to know when they\u2019re installed. Because I\u2019ve got a shower that was actually installed last year and I phoned up last week to start the warranty. I thought you\u2019re talking about handover of information, the digital twins, particularly that platform, made it really easy for us in my last role\u2026we were using it, it was me building the models and indicating the data and we had one of the clients who was actually Wheatley, who I\u2019m working for at the moment. One of their team, we gave them a login, so they were adding in data and I was adding in data. And there are now bits you can do, you can send everybody\u2019s favourite email updates using the platform.<\/p>\n

So if somebody went right, there\u2019s your warranty information, you can set it up to send a notification to whoever it is that\u2019s dealing with it. Other than that, you\u2019ve just got to have that one, I like to call it the clerk of BIM, a digital clerk of works, if you like. A person that goes around saying you said you\u2019d have this information by this point\u2026most of the time, I\u2019m sure the contractors will just go at handover at least point you in the right direction so you can go and get it.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON That\u2019s a really good contribution. I wear two hats, I\u2019m BIM3Housing which is my voluntary stuff and my company Active Plan. We\u2019re a Revit developer, so we\u2019re an Autodesk developer, so I was involved with the Tandem development back about 3 years ago when it was just coming through. But I\u2019m encouraged to hear that somebody has actually got it working, I\u2019ve not heard of anybody that has, to be honest. I don\u2019t mean that in a disparaging way because obviously it\u2019s in our interests to see it working well.<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON There\u2019s a lot I would change, but it was\u2026it\u2019s quite a simple tool that makes it really easy for some of the people that you deal with. At least the people that I\u2019ve met in housing associations who would look at the models, it\u2019s easy for them to understand how to use it. it did exactly what you needed it to do.\u00a0 We were developing something in the background that we can bring a few things using Unreal Engine, but when I was speaking to the people at Autodesk they said that that\u2019s the kind of level that they were aspiring to get to and it was growing. The stuff that you can do in Unreal Engine\u00a0 is, I mean you need to have computer geniuses in order to work out how to link things together in Unreal Engine, it\u2019s quite a tricky programme to learn how to use. And you can link Revit models to Unreal Engine and you get this ultra-realism.<\/p>\n

And you can build Grand Theft Auto apps of real places which made it quite good. The Tandem stuff, I think it\u2019s a really good programme for housing associations. It\u2019s quite basic in what it can do, but it\u2019s easy enough if you\u2019ve got the right people who can show us how to work it (I\u2019m in a housing association now). It\u2019s because I\u2019ve been using Autodesk since I was at Uni, it\u2019s quite easy to understand. Everybody knows what a PDF is and if you right click this, and then go to this bit you just need to press this button and then frag and drop, and they go oh, that\u2019s great. How do I set up an email notification? Oh, don\u2019t worry about that, we\u2019ll set that up for you. It\u2019s just 8having that clerk of BIM type person to do it.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON That\u2019s very helpful, it would be really interesting to talk to people who are actually now continuing to use it. Are you one of those people that continue to use it?<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON Well, as I say, that part of the Sure Serve Group got shut down, so they took us on with the idea that we would end up doing what we were doing before. But being a housing association we needed get us in some capacity, so we\u2019re doing surveying at the moment. We\u2019re 7 months in and, apart from these meetings, haven\u2019t touched a BIM thing. So, not at the moment, but if they said tomorrow right, we want you to start, then I\u2019d go back to Autodesk without using the Tandem stuff.<\/p>\n

RICHARD WHITTAKER Where I used to work, they had a digital twin and it cost them millions. And they couldn\u2019t keep up with the skill set required to actually operate the digital twin within the organisation because they\u2019d got other priorities like 5,000 live orders to get through and black mould and all of that sort of thing. So, they were forever getting competing priorities and people moving round. And quite often in lots of places, asset is a high turnover environment, so you have to have this constant training thing. The solution for me is data containers that you can just search because people know how to search a computer, it\u2019s a very simple thing to do. So, if you\u2019ve got something that you can just log onto and search it\u2019s going to he helpful.<\/p>\n

And the thing that\u2019s going to drive it forward in terms of use, there\u2019s a couple of things. One, contract clauses in terms of putting in digital information as part of the contract. And the other one is such as HSE, who could very easily insist that a health & safety file is built in the same way as a CDM file, so that it\u2019s audited on a pretty regular basis. And without that, attracting people into it is going to be difficult because of damp and mould, because of all sorts of different reasons within construction. It sounds a bit negative, but I think it\u2019s pretty realistic.<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON Yeah, the time that I was working on it, the digital twins that we were building in the background using Unreal Engine, we\u2019d always link to your internal database. So, if somebody wanted to search a computer then it would be searched, if somebody wanted to walk through the building virtually then they could also do that. So, you did have the two options. We found, it was maybe because we were excited about using this new, shiny digital technology, we went oh, why don\u2019t we try it this way and just update it. Because if you look at a building and you know what it is that you\u2019re looking for visually, it feels either like OK, where\u2019s the cooker? the cooker is in the kitchen. Oh, alright, just got to the kitchen, the search that works as well.<\/p>\n

What we found was when you get to 5,000 properties and having a folder structure that good, if you type in warranty or you type in echo fire smoke alarm, then you get 5,000 smoke alarms come up. So, your folder structure needs to be pretty spot on. As I\u2019m saying that I\u2019m thinking in my head well, it doesn\u2019t really matter which way you go, you start to search for something\u2026<\/p>\n

RICHARD WHITTAKER It\u2019s the easy search that\u2019s essential and your UPRN, which every housing association has, is something that fixes the 5,000 returns from a search.<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON You need to know the URRN though, I\u2019m assuming that other housing associations have better UPRN numbers than what we\u2019ve got.<\/p>\n

RICHARD WHITTAKER I\u2019ve never met one that hasn\u2019t, yet.<\/p>\n

CONNOR STEVENSON It really does have UPRNs, but they make absolutely no sense.<\/p>\n

RICHARD WHITTAKER Well, that\u2019s a separate conversation than what it is, because it could be an address with a postcode or whatever. But the other thing where I worked previously was they wanted it to feed into their existing asset management database, rather than being multiple standalone systems. And that raised some concerns around risk, integrity of the information and all of that side of it. Dynamic linking is easy, getting the right information through the dynamic link is a different question altogether.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON One of the biggest challenges is how do you collect the information in a form that can then be easily checked and audited. I\u2019ll just give you an example of how we\u2019ve been doing it. We\u2019ve been doing this now for several years, I can also show you how we fit this into the work that we\u2019re doing with the HSE. Which actually, that might be of interest to Bex and Dave, and Sen has not seen it. (shares screen<\/em>). Just looking at the digital twin bit, this is an integration of various different applications. We\u2019ve got the Autodesk construction cloud there. If, for example, we\u2019re looking for a fire damper, what we\u2019ve got here is the fire damper modelled, but actually we\u2019ve got the database or the data behind it, is in Sequel so it\u2019s easy to find.<\/p>\n

So, if you\u2019re looking for a fire damper, you can see all of the different types of fire dampers because we\u2019ve got it tied back to manufacturer\u2019s product data as well. Not in the model, that\u2019s important, it\u2019s connected to the model via APIs. And then all of the information, we can then see where that is, you can have a very simple view of it. So, you can look at it in 3D, but a lot of FMs prefer it in 2D, and you can also have it connected to a 360 photo. So, here we\u2019ve got a schedule of the fire dampers and then it takes you to that individual as-built fire damper, actually in the building. That means that you\u2019re not then reliant on every single element to be modelled because, quite frankly, a lot of M&E elements aren\u2019t modelled in any detail because nobody is paying for that.<\/p>\n

And this is now connecting it back to all of the documentation. So, it\u2019s a combination of various different things, that\u2019s the approach that we\u2019re taking on quite a few projects at the moment. The important thing is that people need to be able to create the information in a standardised, structured way. The other aspect of this is being able to collect what actually gets installed. So the handover information, for example, needs to start much earlier in the process where the operations team become part of the validation process at earlier stages. So here, for example, there is no reason why the FM team shouldn\u2019t be involved when products are actually being considered.<\/p>\n

BEX GIBSON And that goes hand in hand with soft landings. In reality, we were discussing this last time, everyone loves soft landing and we\u2019d love to do that, but in our busy, hectic organisations you\u2019ve got your development team and then you\u2019ve got the operations team. And then I guess that\u2019s why we\u2019re here, is to work out that sweet spot of coordination, but in reality it\u2019s quite tricky one to get right.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON The principle here, Connor, is that the actual product that\u2019s being installed can be tested against the information requirements. And then the product that probably actually gets installed, which often gets changed, that gets picked up so that it can then be compared. So, this is a technical submittal process, which I[\u2018m sure you\u2019re familiar with. And in this case, we\u2019ve got people like Bouygues and Waites that are involved in this, so the technical submittal tells you what the product is that should be installed and then also what product is actually going to be used.<\/p>\n

And that gets put into a product library which can then be used to record what was (this is a standardised technical submittal), so that you can then say what product is being proposed, so that it can then pick up when something gets changed. And that then gets signed off. But you can also do comparisons, so as part of that sign-off process you can compare products. So, in this case, comparing a number of boilers, or comparing doors against a specification. So, you\u2019ve then got a track record of what was being proposed and what\u2019s actually being delivered. And then that then, you\u2019ve got a golden thread link through to what gets procured and installed. So, that\u2019s broadly part of what we\u2019re doing.<\/p>\n

And this is going through the exercise of auditing, this is one of Origin\u2019s projects where 4 big blocks, we identified some of the key information. Like here, for example, this is fire stopping, and you can see that that fire stopping drawing isn\u2019t really fit for purpose because all of the lozenges are overlapping each other. So, that\u2019s something that should have been checked by the employer\u2019s agent, should have been checked by the construction company because that actually is useless. And then the methodology, this is an earlier version of the one that Dave was showing earlier. So, the principle here is that you can then set out what information is required, and where it\u2019s green it means that it\u2019s provided. But then when it\u2019s red, it\u2019s missing.<\/p>\n

And you can then use that to audit the information so that we can actually identify were data sheets supposed to have been provided, was there a certificate of conformance, so that can then be tied back to the AIR. And then this is the work that we\u2019ve been doing with the HSE to be able to take information that may be in folders in SharePoint, bring them to a database, but the database is standardised. So let me just skip off to that. This is a standardised folder structure of looking at what\u2019s in a health & safety file. Because health & safety files tend to be fairly standardised, not so much the O&Ms. And what we\u2019re doing here with this group, we\u2019ve got a group of people within BIM In Asset Management that are working on this to actually say what should be in a document, what should be data, how should it be classified, how should to be searched for?<\/p>\n

And then we can then go through, we\u2019ve got essentially a check list for the various different, for constructional consultants there\u2019s some key documents there. For mechanical services consultants, some key documents and then we\u2019ve got the various different work packages. But what we\u2019re doing here, we\u2019re trying to encourage people to think about systems rather than just its mechanical services or electrical services. To try and get people to think about these from a point of view of networks and circuits and things like that. So, the principle of capturing the information is then standardised\u2026so what you\u2019re then able to do is to look at things from a database perspective where you can add metadata to items. So you can pull out, for example as Bex was saying earlier, all of the information that needs to go into a fire and emergency file. Now, that can come from lots of different folders.<\/p>\n

To try and put them into folders, using folders as a way that you would use information is not sensible because you\u2019re never going to get enough folders for all of the different ways that people want to look at information. And also, once they\u2019re in a database you can then connect them, So, you can connect, for example, data in a door schedule with the spaces that those doors relate to. And then you can then present those in a simple way because in many cases you want a simple graphic that shows that that particular door is protecting that stairwell. And then connecting the documents into the model so that you can then say those documents relate to these systems. So, then something from a commissioning folder then gets referenced back to the particular element.<\/p>\n

Because really you don\u2019t want to go from maybe you\u2019re looking at something, a particular system, you don\u2019t want to have to go off to a folder that says commissioning and then look through 200 commissioning certificates, it wants to be glued together. So, that\u2019s the sort of methodology and by following that sort of method we\u2019ve then got a way of then connecting everything up. That\u2019s one solution to it, I guess the question that we need to ask is what\u2019s actually needed from an operations point of view? And, to an extent, let\u2019s try and create the information requirements at the outset so that is easy to collect, that\u2019s what we want to try and get to. Sen, was that helpful?<\/p>\n

SOUMAN SEN Very much so, I think your final point about having some sort of uniformity on how the information comes over. I think that\u2019s the key issue I have and the information I share with other colleagues, you\u2019re working with different developers, different sizes. We\u2019ve worked with Bouygues, I won\u2019t say they understand it, they maybe have some more interest in the wider business area. Smaller developers, struggling to just get the work, happy to have the council as a client. They\u2019re just kind of grabbing anything and everything and giving it to you. Maybe trying to be helpful, but giving you just random things that are not helpful at all. So, some uniformity - that would be key really.<\/p>\n

And you guys have spoken about SharePoint and probably had some negative thoughts on it, I thought it was quite good, actually, but probably not for exactly what we\u2019re doing here. But everything has its pros and cons and it\u2019s a system the council use across all of our services and I found it quite useful.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Yeah, certainly we use SharePoint as well, I think most people do, it\u2019s a critical part of anybody\u2019s IT infrastructure. It\u2019s just if, for example, you\u2019re using it to hold health & safety files and O&M information, one of the big challenges is permissions. Because you might put something in thinking that other people can see it, but you can\u2019t because of all of the restrictions that are quite correctly there for that particular purpose.<\/p>\n

DAVE WILLIAMS One of the other downsides of SharePoint is the file path character limit which everyone has, no doubt, come across. Because if you have a folder structure and then a subfolder structure underneath that and then a subfolder structure underneath that. And then you\u2019ve got a document which is\u2026and this happens particularly with things like plans where they have a specific format for the file naming of a plan which is already 20 characters long. And by the time you\u2019ve stuck that plan in the subfolder of a subfolder of a subfolder of a folder, you\u2019ve breached the 256 character limit. And then you can\u2019t access it and you can\u2019t even often store document in SharePoint if it\u2019s going to breach that limit. So, it\u2019s a major shortcoming of using SharePoint.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON And you don\u2019t know that it\u2019s happened. So, you can import things in and not actually realise that it\u2019s happened. Sen, I don\u2019t think anybody is denigrating SharePoint, it\u2019s just what it\u2019s designed to do, as it were.<\/p>\n

SOUMAN SEN Yeah, that\u2019s a good point actually, I\u2019ve seen that as well. Folders within folders and suddenly realising, what\u2019s happened here.<\/p>\n

GEROGE STEVENSON One of the interesting things, like all big organisations, Tower Hamlets have got, we\u2019re implementing Active Plan across the board across all of the properties. So therefore you\u2019ve got some of the technology that I\u2019ve just been showing you there, available to use. But everybody has been concentrating at the moment on getting all of the floor plans done and 360 photos. Do you know Margina?<\/p>\n

SOUMAN SEN Yes, I do, I\u2019ve just recently moved over to the same kind of directorate as Margina, and I\u2019ve heard of Active Plan from her in the last couple of weeks.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Yeah, it would be interesting to see what your needs are to see how that fits in, but I don\u2019t want to hijack this for that purpose. Bex, Dave, what do you think? Do you think we\u2019ve reached the limit of what we can do today?<\/p>\n

DAVE WILLIAMS I would have thought so. One of the things that we were looking to do in this meeting, with a wider audience, was what Sen was saying, is just share experiences of development handover with a view that some people might be doing something smarter than other people that other people hadn\u2019t thought of. And we\u2019ve sort of done that within our limited group of people, in our limited experience. If there had of been a wider audience I think we probably would have got some different viewpoints. I think probably the same old pain points, right across the board. I don\u2019t think that anyone has come up with the magic bullet for this yet, but it would be interesting to see what other people have done that perhaps you think oh, actually, that\u2019s an idea.<\/p>\n

GEORGE STEVENSON Sen, have you got any standard methods or templates or anything like that that you\u2019re using?<\/p>\n

SOUMAN SEN No, we don\u2019t, we have ERs and we set out something, but the principal contractors don\u2019t usually stick to that. We\u2019ve been fortunate that we\u2019ve worked with some of the bigger ones like Bouygues, so the information does come over in a decent format that we\u2019re comfortable with. But we\u2019ve not been able to get them to work to one way of doing things.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<\/div><\/div><\/div><\/div><\/div>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

BIM4HOUSING: OPERATIONS WORKING GROUP MEETING 05-03-2025 GEORGE STEVENSON I had a meeting with the HSE on Monday with the people that we\u2019ve been dealing with on the standardised health & safety file. One of the challenges that I think everybody struggles with is that all of the handover information that\u2019s coming through is unique. So,…<\/p>\n

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